Chamber and committees

I am not unaware of Christine Grahame’s member’s bill. On her first point, and to go back to the previous discussion, encouraging responsible ownership has to cover people’s being conscious of where they buy a puppy in the first place.

We welcome proposals that seek to improve animal welfare, including Christine Grahame’s proposed bill on the welfare of dogs. I thank her for sharing a recent draft. Officials are still considering the proposals, and I look forward—or rather, Mairi Gougeon, who is the appropriate cabinet secretary, looks forward—to discussing the bill in further detail once she has had the chance to fully consider it.

As we have heard, animal welfare is an important and emotive issue. I am sure that all members will welcome the opportunity to consider what more can be done to strengthen Scotland’s high animal welfare standards.

I have already mentioned the support of working in collaboration with the SSPCA. Police Scotland has an overall increase of £40 million in its budget for the current year; however, the operational methods by which it drives down the trade are, of course, a matter for Police Scotland.

I hope that Finlay Carson will take some comfort from the fact that the serious organised crime task force is looking at the issue. It involves 13 organisations, including the Society of Local Authority Chief Executives and Senior Managers, the National Crime Agency, COSLA and Police Scotland. Its refreshed strategy was published in February. Although the aims and objectives remain broadly the same, I go back to the first point that was made by Jamie Greene: as well as the trade’s being appalling in itself, its proceeds sometimes feed further illicit activity, in relation to drugs.

There is a very serious focus on the issue. It is not always possible to be explicit about the way in which we are trying to deal with it, because, obviously, we do not want to forearm those who are involved in the activity. However, Finlay Carson should be reassured that there is a joint approach that takes in the Irish Government as well as the UK Government and HM Revenue and Customs.

The Scottish Government continues to work with a number of key stakeholder organisations and other Administrations through the puppy trade working group to disrupt the activities of those who are involved in the unlicensed puppy trade. We have also run several puppy campaigns over the past few years to highlight the cruelty of the trade, to raise public awareness and to provide advice on how to buy a puppy safely.

New animal licensing regulations were introduced in 2021 that cover the breeding and selling of dogs, and further regulation is planned using powers that are set out in the Animal Welfare (Kept Animals) Bill, which is progressing through the United Kingdom Parliament.

Serious organised crime affects us all, and we can all play a part in reducing the harm that it causes. Raising awareness of the nature of the threats that we face is one part of that response. The Scottish Government and its partners on the serious organised crime task force oversee work to reduce the harm that is caused by serious organised crime in Scotland, and they will continue to use every means at their disposal to disrupt serious organised crime.

On the last point that Jamie Greene raised, different crimes or elements of crimes can be recorded in different ways. I am happy to make sure that the answer that I give covers all the different ways in which the illicit puppy trade might be touched on, and I will provide that information to him in writing.

I challenge the point about how much is being done. The scale and significance of the trade was the driver behind the creation of the puppy trade working group, back in early 2018. That United Kingdom and Republic of Ireland group includes key animal welfare organisations; the Scottish Government; the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs; HM Revenue and Customs; the Irish Revenue; and the Convention of Scottish Local Authorities. Jamie Greene rightly identifies that one of the ports of entry is Stranraer, which is why we also work collaboratively with the Irish Government.

The principal aim is to disrupt unlicensed, low-welfare puppy farming and the associated criminal activity, which is taken very seriously. Jamie Greene will be aware that much of what we could say in relation to the SMASTA and the serious crime strategy is not made public for reasons that he will understand, but I am happy to make sure that as much information as possible is provided to him to convince him that we are doing what we need to do.

Further action is proposed, not least in relation to the age at which puppies may be transported. The transportation of dogs that are late in their gestation period, which is often hard to determine, is also going to be addressed, perhaps by reducing the periods in which pregnant dogs can be transported. We are taking serious action, and I am happy to follow that answer up by writing to the member.

I understand the point that Pauline McNeill is making, but she also started her comments by saying that she knows that I cannot comment on some of those things. Whatever else it was, the decision was taken by an independent Crown Office, so she knows the constraints around what I can say, but she also knows the process for accountability that is in train for that. If there is a subsequent inquiry, that will also be independent. That is the reason why I am not able to say more at this stage.

If there is a public inquiry, some people would term that as a process of accountability.

That has been established in the First Minister’s responses in the chamber on a number of occasions.

I am grateful that you acknowledge the pressures. You mentioned the idea of a cap. There is a cap—there is a cap on all that we do in the sense that we have the block grant, added to by whatever tax that we raise here and other sources of income. Therefore, that cap exists and has always been there. You are right that the question is how to marry things up within those pressures. I have no intention of overseeing a budget for the police force that results in 4,000 officers leaving. Despite press reports to the contrary, we have a very stable workforce in the police in Scotland—much more so than is the case in other parts of the UK—and there is real interest in applying for senior positions in the police force here.

On the point about situations where the police do not turn up for things, that has happened in many communities south of the border. In some communities south of the border, there has been no investigation of burglaries and other crimes for over a year and there is no intention to hold those investigations. We do not intend to oversee such a situation. However, I know from the discussions that I have had with the Scottish Police Authority and the police that they want to ensure that their model of policing is up to date and fit for going forward, rather than always looking back.

It is worth pointing out that the police start from a very strong basis. A police constable in Scotland gets about £5,000 more per year when they start than those elsewhere, and every rank up to assistant chief constable is paid higher in Scotland than elsewhere. We also have some of the lowest-ever recorded levels of crime. Therefore, the police start from a strong position and they do not intend to yield that position.

Based on the discussions that I have had, I think that there will be reprioritisation. Cybercrime is a real challenge, and the police will want to do more on that. There might also be a reconfiguration with regard to how the police want to deal with violence against women and girls. The position will develop over time, but the police will not have that level of fall-off in officer numbers—at least, there will not be a net fall-off of 4,000 officers. We do not intend to see that happen at all.

Yes, I think that it will remain in operation, and no, of course I am not happy when there has been a service failure. Those failures have been well publicised, and I have raised them with both the SPA and the chief constable when they have happened.

However, the contact assessment model that is now used is very effective when it is used properly. That is probably borne out by the fact that in Scotland—I think that I am right in saying—the number of calls that are answered within 10 seconds is around 10 per cent higher than it is elsewhere in the UK. The rate for the proportion of calls that are answered in under 10 seconds currently sits at around 79.9 per cent, in comparison with 68.3 per cent for the rest of the UK. That should not be the only bar, however, and we acknowledge that the rate has to be higher. Nonetheless, the rest of the UK is a useful comparison, because many of the same pressures apply.

We have had the HM Inspectorate of Constabulary in Scotland assurance review into the contact assessment model for call handling. I do not deny that it identifies issues, but it also identifies a number of real successes. We welcome Police Scotland’s plans to introduce the new digital contact platform, which will help to strengthen both the 101 and 999 services. Once again, I highlight that those are operational matters for the chief constable, and oversight of them is provided by the Scottish Police Authority.

It is not a new idea that you can achieve efficiencies if you build something new according to modern standards and if you do it in the right way, not least because you can also make it much more efficient in terms of the climate change challenge. The proposed prison in the Highlands—the replacement for HMP Inverness—will be our first net zero prison, so yes, of course, we can make efficiencies. For a number of years, we have had a programme of renewing what is, in essence, a Victorian estate. We are going through that process. The business case is developed for each proposition that we have.