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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 5 March 2026
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Displaying 1841 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Shona Robison

We want to give stability to taxpayers, and so we feel that we have probably gone as far as we should go. We have asked those with the broadest shoulders to pay a bit more, which has helped us with, for example, tackling child poverty. Scotland is the only part of the UK where child poverty rates are falling. That does not happen accidentally; it comes from investment in tackling child poverty, and that investment has come from those with the broadest shoulders paying a bit more, although the majority of Scottish taxpayers will still pay less.

You are right that thresholds will be frozen, but that is the case in the rest of the UK as well. If I remember rightly, the previous UK Government set a policy to freeze the thresholds until 2028, and the current Labour UK Government has continued with that. We believe that the tax strategy that has been laid out strikes the right balance in giving certainty about there being no further changes to tax thresholds until the end of this parliamentary session. That is the right thing to do.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Shona Robison

As you well know, that is not what the First Minister said.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Shona Robison

The key difference is the granular detail of what the plan will involve. That relates to a point that Michelle Thomson made about data. Ivan McKee is going much more into the detail of the figures relating to each and every public body, and every public body will be tasked with making its own plans for savings and reform down to a level of detail that might have been absent when there was a higher-level requirement for efficiency savings across the board, or for policies that were quite broad in nature. The difference is that each and every public body will be required to deliver a plan for efficiency, reform, sharing services and doing things differently. Doing nothing will not be an option, and the reform will be far more directed.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Shona Robison

I will come back to you, because some of those points are still to be agreed with COSLA.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Shona Robison

I might have misspoken when I said that. “Misspoken” might be too strong a term, but I would rephrase it. It is more that Councillor Hagmann has been engaging with Opposition spokespeople on COSLA’s behalf, which is absolutely fine. We will do the next phase, which is about building consensus, jointly. I hope that makes sense.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Shona Robison

There was no scorecard that said, “This is the range of options and this is compared with that.” There were ministerial discussions on a number of occasions about what evidence other organisations, including child poverty organisations, had brought to us. I mentioned some of them earlier. As one, they said that other things could be done but that that was the one thing that would make the biggest impact. Ministers were being challenged by the First Minister to look at what more could be done to tackle child poverty, and that was the one option that emerged with support from all the child poverty organisations.

11:15  

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Shona Robison

The advice that came back was about costings and the likely impact on the number of children who would be kept out of poverty. The 15,000 figure has been superseded to some degree by the Fraser of Allander Institute saying that it could be higher than that and that

“20,000 children would be kept out of poverty”.

At the time, that work was presented to us in terms of the costings. The SFC has now given us its analysis of the costings, which is at the higher end of what we had thought.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Shona Robison

It is the third sector organisations that we took advice from. Bearing in mind the fact that we have a statutory duty to reduce child poverty rates, the First Minister asked us to go further in tackling child poverty and so he charged us to go further in discussions with those child poverty organisations. Mitigating the two-child cap was their clear recommendation to us.

After ministers discussed that at some length, we asked for costings and how many children would be lifted out of poverty and so on, and that is what is in front of Parliament, for it to vote for or not to vote for.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Shona Robison

No. No ministerial direction has been required. In the context of civil service, every policy and spend will be reminders of the overall fiscal position and sustainability. That happens with every policy. However, Michael, your party wanted us to do it from this April, which would have had an even bigger cost, about which the Scottish Fiscal Commission might have had something to say. I think that we are all agreed on the policy.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Shona Robison

In advance of September, I am happy to brigade together, across portfolios, the projects that are in the public domain. One of the largest projects is HMP Glasgow—there is considerable capital investment in that new prison—and I have talked about affordable housing. We could brigade other projects together across portfolios if that would be helpful.

The infrastructure investment plan will give a line of sight for multiyear projects—when they will begin their process, the earlier stages in the business cases and their delivery. We need multiyear capital envelopes in order to give certainty to the public sector in relation to taking forward projects.

In response to your question, convener, if we can provide further information across portfolios, and if it would be helpful to brigade that information in one place in advance of that work, I will be happy to come back to the committee with that.