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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 17 February 2026
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Displaying 1523 contributions

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Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Scottish Fire and Rescue Service

Meeting date: 4 February 2026

Pauline McNeill

Is it for ministers to make the final decision?

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Scottish Fire and Rescue Service

Meeting date: 4 February 2026

Pauline McNeill

I will move on to talk about response times to emergency incidents. Your submission says that increasing response times to emergency incidents as a result of the 23 options is routinely described as a “tolerable risk”, but that the FBU does not accept that ever-increasing response times are tolerable. The submission goes on to talk about a date in 2025 when there were 1,069 non-fatal fire casualties—a 30 per cent increase—and says that there would have been more fatalities had there not been early intervention. What will the budget and the review of the service mean for response times? That is what the public will want to know.

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Scottish Fire and Rescue Service

Meeting date: 4 February 2026

Pauline McNeill

In other words, both capital and revenue are driving a move towards a retained duty system. As we know, in some areas, that is needed, but you are saying that budget constraints are a driving force for more of that.

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Scottish Fire and Rescue Service

Meeting date: 4 February 2026

Pauline McNeill

Yes, I noted that. Will you provide estimates on that at some point?

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Scottish Fire and Rescue Service

Meeting date: 4 February 2026

Pauline McNeill

If you could do the latter, that would be great.

I am aware that, over many years, there have been discussions about the changing role of firefighters and work is under way on other jobs that firefighters could undertake. However, carrying out those other roles will be much more difficult under the proposed budget. Is it time to tell the Government that it is not possible to enter into any further discussions about changing the firefighter role if you are facing a reduction in firefighter numbers?

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Scottish Fire and Rescue Service

Meeting date: 4 February 2026

Pauline McNeill

Can you not be more transparent? You say that a final decision will be made, but we have no idea right now what the analysis looks like. Many people have participated in the consultation, the options are wide and varied, and then you will make a final decision in June. Surely there should be an intermediate stage when we get an indication of the direction that you are heading in. We are talking about the potential closure of fire stations and changes to the service. A lot of things could happen.

I think that you know that it would be very hard for future elected MSPs to unpick a final decision when we do not even know, as we are sitting here in February, what direction you are heading in.

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Scottish Fire and Rescue Service

Meeting date: 4 February 2026

Pauline McNeill

I want to check that I have understood what you have said. Are you saying that budget constraints may be the driving force behind reducing the number of whole-time firefighters and having more firefighters who are on the retained duty system? You have said that you do not know the modelling and you are being told, “Well, we won’t know until we try.” Are you saying that the move to having fewer whole-time firefighters and more retained firefighters is a response to the implications of the budget?

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Scottish Fire and Rescue Service

Meeting date: 4 February 2026

Pauline McNeill

Thank you very much.

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Scottish Fire and Rescue Service

Meeting date: 4 February 2026

Pauline McNeill

I am not sure that it is that easy to separate the implications of the budget from the delivery review. However, in its submission, the FBU says that the full implications of the option to replace some whole-time firefighters with retained firefighters are not widely understood by the people who took part in the consultation process. Stuart Stevens, does the budget make that move more likely?

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Scottish Fire and Rescue Service

Meeting date: 4 February 2026

Pauline McNeill

To be clear, I am not doubting that.