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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 27 June 2025
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Displaying 2650 contributions

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Meeting of the Parliament (Virtual)

Covid-19

Meeting date: 13 July 2021

Nicola Sturgeon

That is an important question, as it has been almost since day 1 of the pandemic. There are—quite properly and legitimately—different rules in place in different parts of the UK. That is what happens when we have democratically accountable Government taking decisions that they then must justify to their electorates.

However, that means that there can be confusion about which rules apply in which parts of the UK. We have sought, through our marketing, radio and television advertising campaigns, and through my briefings—which are no longer daily, but I do them periodically—to make sure that we are communicating as clearly as possible in a complex situation what the rules in place in Scotland are. We will continue to do that at each phase of the pandemic. I say again that anybody who wants to check the detail of the rules can do that on the Scottish Government website.

Meeting of the Parliament (Virtual)

Covid-19

Meeting date: 13 July 2021

Nicola Sturgeon

Those are important issues. I recognise the frustration and pressures that the situation causes, not so much for people who want to visit our islands—although they are not unimportant—but particularly for those who live on our islands and who rely on ferry transport to get on and off islands. In common with providers of other modes of transport, CalMac is operating with reduced passenger capacity, which is in line with physical distancing guidance. Transport Scotland engages regularly with ferry operators on how to balance safety measures and efforts to maximise capacity. I think that the most recent meeting was at the end of last week. Obviously, crew and passenger safety is a key factor in determining the capacity of vessels.

The impact is understood. I know that CalMac has introduced turn-up-and-go spaces and has put in place a protocol to ensure that islanders who need to travel for short-notice reasons can do so. We will continue to engage closely on that issue. Vehicle capacity is mostly unaffected by physical distancing, but currently there are particularly high levels of demand for travel to the islands, so we are continuing to explore the potential charter of an additional vessel that would provide additional capacity on the Stornoway to Ullapool route. The Minister for Transport will keep the member and others updated on that.

Meeting of the Parliament (Virtual)

Covid-19

Meeting date: 13 July 2021

Nicola Sturgeon

That consideration has been a central part of our decision making in advance of today. We increasingly hear a line of argument—I understand the sentiments that drive it; I really do—that we should not be bothered about case numbers, because Covid is now mainly, but not exclusively, although much more than it was before, affecting younger people, and because younger people are far less likely to end up in hospital, to become seriously ill or to die.

Because the link between cases and serious acute illness has weakened, we are not as driven only by case numbers, as was the case previously. However, long Covid is one of the reasons why we cannot simply be unbothered—if that is the correct word, or if it is a word at all—about the level of cases, because we do not yet know the impact that Covid will have in the long term on some young people. Many people will have seen BBC Scotland’s Lucy Adams’s report yesterday about her experience of long Covid. It is horrific to think about and to listen to what it has done to people.

We have to be cautious, because every infection now could be a long Covid case in the future, which would cause misery for individuals and put huge pressure on our NHS. For how long, we do not yet know. That is another reason for care and caution.

Although it is frustrating for many of us, we must continue to take a very gradual route through the pandemic while, of course—as others have rightly said—continuing to develop, understand and build the services that will be needed to deal with the implications of long Covid.

Meeting of the Parliament (Virtual)

Covid-19

Meeting date: 13 July 2021

Nicola Sturgeon

That is an excellent question. In terms of environmental mitigations that we can bring to bear against Covid, ventilation is one of the most important aspects that we must think about. The short answer is yes; I have asked for work to be done to consider how we can much more radically improve ventilation in public buildings, and how we can make much more use of, for example, carbon dioxide monitoring as a proxy measure of air quality to give some assurance about whether a particular environment has the ventilation that is required to deal with Covid.

There are also issues that healthcare workers will raise, as we come to understand more about airborne transmission, in relation to whether we should continue to develop approaches to appropriate personal protective equipment, for example.

Ventilation and the implications of airborne transmission are, increasingly, key parts of our decision making. I will keep Parliament updated on our work on ventilation. Of all the very good questions that I have been asked today, that is possibly one of the most important in relation of how we can do what everybody wants, which is to learn to live with the virus in the longer term.

Meeting of the Parliament (Virtual)

Covid-19

Meeting date: 13 July 2021

Nicola Sturgeon

The changes that I have announced today will come into force from Monday 19 July. I know that that is difficult for those who have weddings planned over the coming weekend, but we have to take decisions based on all the factors that I have set out, and we have to act as proportionately and responsibly as possible. The attendance limit for weddings at level 0 goes up considerably. I will ask the relevant minister to write to Pauline McNeill shortly with all the details of the dos and don’ts that we are advising at weddings to try to get them to operate as normally as possible but within safe boundaries, or boundaries that are as safe as possible.

I know how difficult it is but I cannot emphasise enough what a critical juncture we are at right now—in common, increasingly, with other countries across the UK and Europe. We desperately want to get everybody back to normal but we will set back our efforts to do so if we cease to be responsible, careful and cautious about it. I will provide more granular detail on all those points to Pauline McNeill.

Although I accept that many people disagree with them, as I said earlier, my job is to take such decisions even if they are unpopular, and I hope that people will, at least, know that the decisions are being taken with the utmost care and thought.

Meeting of the Parliament (Virtual)

Covid-19

Meeting date: 13 July 2021

Nicola Sturgeon

To be clear, as I understand it, Wales is using the system that England is using. Because Scotland has a separate contact tracing app, like Northern Ireland, we are developing a different digital system, although it will no doubt operate in the same way. I do not have a date for when that system will be available, but I hope that it will be available later in the summer or into the autumn. I will provide more detail of the precise date as quickly as possible.

Until then, of course, it is possible for people to get a record of their vaccination status through the route that is already in place, and we will make sure that details of how to do that are very visible on our website and other platforms, so that people have an understanding of that.

Meeting of the Parliament (Virtual)

Covid-19

Meeting date: 13 July 2021

Nicola Sturgeon

Obviously, that is a vital part of how we support businesses for as long as they require to work under restrictions. Although we make regular, constant, frequent representations to the UK Government—publicly and privately—about the continuation of furlough, it appears to be adamant about bringing furlough to an end, which is a matter of serious concern. One—although not the only—concern about a divergence between the levels of restrictions that are in place in England and the other UK nations is whether the lifting of all restrictions in England leads to the lifting of all support for Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland, when all three of us are choosing to go at a slower space. It is one thing for the UK Government to say that it respects the rights of the Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish Governments to take our own decisions, but if the UK Government holds the cards with regard to financial support and does not provide the financial support that is appropriate to the decisions that we take, it undermines our ability to fight the virus. Therefore, particularly over the next period, it is really important that the UK Government listens and provides furlough in each of the nations for as long as it is required, in line with the decisions that each nation is taking.

Meeting of the Parliament (Virtual)

Covid-19

Meeting date: 13 July 2021

Nicola Sturgeon

Yes, I stand by that. The release of information such as that and the timing of the release are matters for National Records of Scotland. It does not operate under political pressure, and I do not accept Craig Hoy’s characterisation of what happened. At the time, the cabinet secretary was taking steps to ensure that the correct engagement with the care home sector happened before the release of information, in order that it did not come as a surprise to, for example, bereaved families—it was to ensure that there was proper engagement, in line with guidance. The timing of the release and the fact of the release were matters for NRS.

Meeting of the Parliament (Virtual)

Covid-19

Meeting date: 13 July 2021

Nicola Sturgeon

We will continue to engage with the care home sector and, where necessary, with individual care homes about how more older people can have access to the contact and activities that are so important to their wellbeing. I am happy to ask the health secretary to look at particular cases where care homes are not offering those. I am sure that, in the homes where those are not being offered, that will be for good reasons, but we will continue that engagement. We want people to have as normal engagement with their loved ones and as normal access to activities as possible.

Meeting of the Parliament (Virtual)

Covid-19

Meeting date: 13 July 2021

Nicola Sturgeon

Two thousand is the standard limit for venues to operate without permission. There is a process to apply to stage larger events, which takes account of whether the right mitigations can be in place to make a larger event as safe as possible, and one of the factors is the size of the venue or stadium.

The situation is difficult for people who want to watch their football team or go to other leisure events, but we have to proceed safely and appropriately. Right now, there are countries across Europe that are stopping all large-scale events again—unless I am remembering wrongly, I think that the Netherlands is in that category. We do not want to get to that position, but we are more likely to do so if we take the brakes off too quickly and allow the situation to spiral out of control.