Chamber and committees

I look forward to the education part when the bill is introduced. There is no use in listening to people’s lived experiences and punishing those who have done wrong if we cannot also educate people, because education is very important. I know that you mentioned that, but it is very important.

Thank you all for your opening statements and the briefings that you have provided, and a special thank you to Richy Edwards for sharing his story.

Nick Bland mentioned—this is also in our briefing—that the expert advisory group included a diverse group of individuals from a range of faith and belief organisations and communities, and included mental health and legal professionals. Can you tell the committee whether you felt that there were any gaps in expertise in the group? Were there any areas of conflict or disagreement? If so, what were they, and how did you reach a consensus?

Thank you. You said that sometimes there can be difficult conversations with certain religious groups. We heard concerns throughout the previous evidence session that the ban would restrict religious freedoms. I will just tack on a little bit to that.

You have mentioned many organisations; they are all organisations that are very worthy and do a great job, but I did not hear you mention any of the Jewish, Muslim, Sikh, or Christian faith organisations. What was it like for you to reach out to them? What I am trying to get at here is what Richy Edwards said earlier. It is not about punishing people; we need to educate people. I know, coming from a Sikh background, that in such faith groups, much education is needed so that people can start accepting that this is normality, that these people are around and we all live together and that is the way that it should be. It is about educating people a little bit more, so you need to reach into the faith groups to educate them. Have they allowed your voice to be heard in those faith groups?

Thank you for your presentation, Sandra. Like my colleague Pam Duncan-Glancy, I did not know much about Makaton, so it was really useful to hear about that and about the great work that Margaret Walker has done.

Our briefing for the meeting highlights a

“lack of a routine procedure for identifying individuals with a learning disability”

and a lack of intersectional data. If there was more in-depth data collection about different types of physical and learning disabilities, would that help to identify where Makaton would be most useful and how best it could be delivered in certain services? Which services should it be used in?

Good morning. Ian Duddy, in your opening statement, you mentioned that you are setting out a plan and a vision for the future. With that in mind, we all know that the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child (Incorporation) (Scotland) Bill would have had a significant impact on the Scottish Human Rights Commission, such as through the powers in section 10A. Is the continuing uncertainty around when the amended bill will be reintroduced causing issues for the commission in its long-term planning, and would the commission like more clarity from the Scottish Government on the timescale for the bill’s reintroduction?

Thank you for that information. You have spoken about your budget and your ask for the year ahead. For clarity, is that included in the figure, or is there uncertainty because you are looking for more staff and more money but you are not certain about when the work will come through? That could affect your long-term planning and the budget side.

Thank you.

I had a catch-up call from Ian Duddy, as I am sure my colleagues did. One of the questions that he asked was what the top priorities are in our constituencies and regions. That is important. I do not know how many MSPs the commission has reached out to—perhaps it was just committee members—but all MSPs represent a constituency or region, so it might be good to reach out to them to see what their top concerns are. We are on the ground and we listen to people. Obviously, you mentioned the cost of living, but there are many other areas, so that might be a good idea.

Two weeks ago, the UN special rapporteur on violence against women and girls, Reem Alsalem, raised a number of concerns about the Scottish Government’s proposed Gender Recognition Reform (Scotland) Bill. As you will be aware, Ms Alsalem raised concerns that the Scottish Government’s proposed reforms could

“open the door for violent males who identify as men to abuse the process of acquiring a gender certificate and the rights that are associated with it.”

and that

“This presents potential risks to the safety of women in all their diversity”.

Does the SHRC have any comments to make on that intervention by the United Nations, and do witnesses agree with Reem Alsalem that the bill should be postponed so that such concerns can be properly addressed?

In your opening statement, you mentioned the big areas that you will focus on. How do you come to a conclusion on which areas you would like to focus on in creating your vision and plan?

Thank you, Ian. You are absolutely right that human rights should be for everybody—I have said that many times in the committee and in the chamber—and that is why you are here today. We are talking about these rights, and, yes, these rights should be there to protect trans people as well as women and girls, and that is why the concern exists: we do not want predators out there pretending and able to obtain a gender recognition certificate to do that.

You have talked about concerns; you have mentioned that. Do you not think that it would be a good idea if the Scottish Government were to postpone the bill to look at the concerns, because they have been highlighted? We cannot just dismiss somebody from the United Nations saying something now; I know that you have said that they said something else previously, but it is very clear that that has been said now, so should we not look at that?

This is to protect trans people as well, so that they do not get blamed later on for something. I have said it very plainly and clearly in the committee that we should have rights for everybody, and we need to make sure of that. Trans people really need those rights, and they have been fighting for them. They should get their rights, but we should also make sure that women and girls are safe from the actual, real bad people, not the trans people.