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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 11 September 2025
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Displaying 2021 contributions

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Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 28 March 2023

Pam Duncan-Glancy

Thank you.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 28 March 2023

Pam Duncan-Glancy

Thank you. Convener, can I go on to my next question, which is on the retention of staff, or do you want to bring in other members who might have questions on fees?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 28 March 2023

Pam Duncan-Glancy

I appreciate that answer. The Law Society said that, as a result of that inequality, in the region of tens of thousands of people are missing out on access to justice. If I am honest, I am not sure that going 15 or 20 minutes down the road is exactly what people are looking for. The fact that people in our poorest areas are sharing a very small number of legal aid firms between them probably suggests that there is a bigger problem, and that is borne out by the number of people who are not accessing justice. I hope that something can be done about that through the reviews.

I have a final very quick question. There are a number of issues relating to thresholds for legal aid. It is considered that there might be quite a bit of unmet need, as many people do not qualify for legal aid. Is the Government collecting figures on that?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 28 March 2023

Pam Duncan-Glancy

Thank you, minister—and your officials—for joining us this morning. I will take the question of fees a little further. I am sure that the minister has seen the letter from the Law Society, which says:

“It is simply not palatable to wait this length of time for a mechanism to review fees”.

I take the point about the amount of information that is required to set the starting point, but my understanding was that the review happened a number of years ago, so why we are still where we are now? Minister, are you in a position to say whether there will be any review of the fees in the interim period? If not, will you at least review the impact of the regulations within the next 12 months?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 28 March 2023

Pam Duncan-Glancy

The minister has just brought up the issue of retention, which is really key. Indeed, in the evidence session that we held with a number of organisations on access to justice, we heard that the availability of legal aid solicitors was a huge problem. I just want to get the figures right: the organisations talked, specifically, about huge inequalities in the availability of solicitors and said that, in the 139 poorest areas, there are only 29 legal aid firms—it is either 22 or 29; I will check in a second. In any case, there is only a handful of firms in those areas compared with others.

In view of that, and setting it against the fact that the fees do not appear in any way commensurate with the sort of costs that are involved and that, as a result of the current structure, solicitors who have been working in legal aid are now moving into other areas of law, can the minister set out how the instrument is going to change any of that? If it is not going to do that, what will?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Charities (Regulation and Administration) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 16 March 2023

Pam Duncan-Glancy

Good morning to you and the officials who are joining you, cabinet secretary.

Two weeks ago, we heard from a third sector organisation that

“The proposals that have been consulted on were developed at the very beginning by OSCR and the Scottish Government without input from the SCVO or the”

third

“sector, so the process has very much been focused on proposals favoured by the regulator. I think that that speaks to the increasing calls for a wider review”.—[Official Report, Social Justice and Social Security Committee, 2 March 2023; c 2.]

What is the cabinet secretary’s response to that quote from an organisation in the sector?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Charities (Regulation and Administration) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 16 March 2023

Pam Duncan-Glancy

Finally on the review, how do you intend to involve smaller charities?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Charities (Regulation and Administration) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 16 March 2023

Pam Duncan-Glancy

On that basis, would the cabinet secretary be prepared to consider further legislation if that were the outcome of such a review?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Charities (Regulation and Administration) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 16 March 2023

Pam Duncan-Glancy

Could the review be independent? Would you consider that? A number of organisations told the committee that they felt that the review should be independent. Are you prepared to commit to that?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Charities (Regulation and Administration) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 16 March 2023

Pam Duncan-Glancy

Thank you for those answers.

On another point, witnesses have suggested that a proposal from the original consultation on allowing the reorganisation of charities that were established under royal charters was not included in the bill and that one option would be to clarify the legislation to make it clear that OSCR could approve the reorganisation of such schemes. Would you consider that, whether under the bill or in future legislation, and could the bill introduce measures to help to simplify the process for a charity wishing to change its status to a Scottish charitable incorporated organisation?