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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 15 July 2025
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Displaying 846 contributions

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Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 15 November 2022

Stephanie Callaghan

Thank you, convener—I am back again.

Alison Bavidge is absolutely spot on. We all know that data drives what we do, so data collection is hugely important.

When we look at outcomes, the voices of professionals are often right up there. How can we ensure that we also hear the voices of those who receive care and services, because sometimes their view can be a wee bit different? It is about having parity.

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 15 November 2022

Stephanie Callaghan

I want to briefly pick up on a wee point that Kay McVeigh made about staff feeling that they do not know what will happen or where they will be with their terms and conditions. I thought that TUPE meant that people’s terms and conditions had to be at least as good as their previous ones.

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 15 November 2022

Stephanie Callaghan

That is really interesting, because one of the points that the people whom I spoke to yesterday made was that, last winter, they had one of the lowest delayed discharge rates in Scotland and they felt that data sharing was a huge part of the reason for it.

Colin Poolman’s comments on what else we could put in the bill were also interesting. Is there anything else that witnesses would like to be in the bill to help multidisciplinary working to become more effective, particularly in relation to early intervention and preventative care?

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 15 November 2022

Stephanie Callaghan

That is helpful to know.

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 15 November 2022

Stephanie Callaghan

I thank the witnesses for being here this morning.

Yesterday, we paid a visit to Granite Care Consortium in Aberdeen, which consists of 10 providers. People from the health and social care partnership were there, too. They talked quite a lot about moving away from the time-and-task model to an outcome-based delivery system, which is increasing their capacity. Shona from the health and social care partnership described providers as being like a spider’s web that pulls everything together over the top of the city. Are there opportunities to improve multidisciplinary work by adopting that approach through the national care service? I will go to Alison Bavidge first.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 9 November 2022

Stephanie Callaghan

Are we looking only at children and families or are we looking at the partnership involvement as well?

11:45  

Education, Children and Young People Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 9 November 2022

Stephanie Callaghan

Is statistical information part of that as well? I know that it is gathered in different ways, and that different information is collected in different local authority areas.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 9 November 2022

Stephanie Callaghan

I hear what you say, but the fact is that delivery would still be local. I have sat on integration joint boards, too, so I know where you are coming from.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 9 November 2022

Stephanie Callaghan

That was a good explanation. As we have heard, the Promise involved co-production and co-design. The Promise has been huge. That change in culture and ethos and that focus on relationships and wellbeing have been incredibly important, and it is great that that is coming through into other areas as well. It is very much about the idea that we have been doing things to people rather than with them.

My question may be for Fraser McKinlay. Cameron-Wong said that 5,500 people were involved in the Promise. I am not saying that we would need to look at working at that scale, but co-design is obviously about involving young people and families. Who should be involved? Is co-production well enough understood or is there work to be done around that in order to help the process?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 9 November 2022

Stephanie Callaghan

Does that link in to asset-based community development? Would we be looking only at children and young people and families or would we also look at all the organisations that are involved? A good example of real co-design and co-production in my area is the autism resources co-ordination hub. It starts with the parent carers, but it also involves all the local voluntary groups and third sector organisations. The council is involved and so is the NHS. That has really been co-produced from the bottom up.

That brings me to an aspect of the national care service that we have not really talked about yet, which is all the informal stuff. It is not just about the big aspects of care. We also need to consider all the informal stuff that happens in the background, such as the work of the autism hub. The effect of that is that families and children do not reach crisis point because there is preventative early intervention that is really supportive without it being formal or official—