Chamber and committees

Yes. I am very interested in asking about the private funding that is coming into farming for carbon sequestration. How do you see that working? One of the things that people are up in arms about is big companies coming in, buying huge swathes of land and then saying that they are green because they own an estate in Scotland. Where do you see the private money coming in, and how would you hold it here?

Gentlemen, I am loving this conversation. David Finlay, I think that you and I should sit down over a number of pints and have a lot of blethers. The idea that you just proposed is one that I took to Ross Finnie almost 20 years ago and it was pooh-poohed then. We will see where it goes from here.

Dee Ward, I should register an interest in relation to you, because, many years ago, I bought a blackface tup off your shepherd.

We talk about regenerative farming, but, as a new entrant into farming, I was not bound by the same constraints of what had aye been done. I did things that I thought were right. I always had the environment in mind. I got involved in farming because I wanted to be out in the countryside and I love nature. I was growing clover 30 years ago, and it is now being talked about as a great new product, even though it is not and it has been there for ever. How out of touch is the farming industry with nature-friendly farming? I do not know who is best placed to answer that, but I will go to Andrew Bauer first.

I have loved this conversation. I have just come out of farming and into politics, but maybe I should be back out in the field.

I love the warm, fuzzy glow that we have as we talk about the good things that we could do and so on. I have been going through this process for 20 years, with people trying to link public procurement to local food networks—we coined the phrase “buy local, eat local” almost 20 years ago—and I think that it is all great. I get it. However, public procurement spend in Scotland is worth between £150 million and £180 million, half of which is spent on Scottish produce, the Scottish farm budget at the moment is about £540 million, and the Scottish Government has a fixed budget, which will be determined by what the UK agricultural policy turns out to be. By comparison, supermarket sales of food alone in this country are £12 billion, and another £10 billion is spent in the pub and restaurant sector.

I love what we are talking about—I love to see it happen. However, the reality of those figures demonstrates that we are just tinkering around the edges, so how do you see us getting this approach into the main stream? I see Michael Clarke nodding his head.

I have a brief question that I wanted to ask earlier. You are keeping the calves on the cow, so what kind of bull are you using?

Thank you.

Excellent. Thank you.

I dispute your point that there has not been an uptick in the number of people, particularly in the age group that you mentioned, getting vaccinated. The Deputy First Minister told us that he cannot give a definitive answer, but you also cannot prove a negative. I argue that the scheme has had the effect that we are trying to achieve.

Leon Thompson, what is your position?

As I said, I genuinely have enormous sympathy with the sector, but I also have absolute confidence, knowing the sector as I do, that it will be able to pivot and to manage an extension of the scheme. My biggest concern is about businesses not being able to staff things properly and about the increase in VAT next year. That is a much bigger issue than the vaccination passport scheme being implemented.

Irene Petersen, how widely have you distributed your findings, and how well are they being received?

I thank the witnesses for attending. I have huge sympathy for the industry. I have worked in hospitality. I had a hospitality-style business, I have worked in the food and drink sector and I still have a lot of friends and colleagues who are in it. I have taken time to speak to a lot of them. On John Mason’s point to Gavin Stevenson—I do not mean to pick on you—they are saying, “You know what, see if we’ve got to do it, we’ll do it because we’ll stay open.” That is the biggest message that I have coming back to me.

If they have a concern, it is that they cannot get enough staff. You are saying that businesses must work at 90 per cent of capacity to break even and keep going. However, a lot of businesses are working at 70 to 75 per cent capacity already because they cannot get more staff. That is the biggest issue that I am getting back.

I will also pick up on Brian Whittle’s point about how getting on top of the situation requires a community effort. We are very fortunate in this committee because we get evidence not just from medical and epidemiological experts, but from everywhere. I get that your interest is to look after your industry, but it is still a societal problem.

We know that vaccination passports were targeted at a particular age group to bring up their vaccination numbers and that that has worked to a certain extent. Therefore, I would be comfortable to see the vaccination passport extended, because it makes the messaging a lot easier. One of the things that we have explored in committee religiously is how the messaging has gone out. If people know that, between now and Christmas, they must have a vaccination passport, they will get it. In my view, if that drives up vaccination numbers, it is worth it, because your businesses will stay open. If we do not have passports and we go into another lockdown, everything will shut. Gavin Stevenson, I am happy to argue the point with you, so please come back to me.

I confirm that I have written to the chief executive of NHS Tayside, and if her next date is cancelled, I will be on the phone.

I want to ask about at-home boosters. We are being inundated with people who cannot get out and who require a booster jag. They are coming up to seven, eight or nine months since their second jag, but there seems to be a disconnect between general practice surgeries and the healthcare system when it comes to putting the two together. We are getting cases where people are not even on the system. There is something wrong somewhere. Would it be possible to find out what the problem is, so that those elderly patients can get back out into society?