Chamber and committees

A constituent of mine who bought a new-build flat several years ago has been in touch. The habitation certificate had been granted, but it later transpired that the flat has very little sound or fire proofing, and after a multitude of surveys to the cost of the residents, it was deemed that the health and safety standards of the building are inadequate. The builder went into liquidation shortly after the sale of the flats. What procedures are in place to protect people who buy properties in good faith when the builders go into liquidation and are not accountable for their development?

I welcome the bill before Parliament today.

“I have been attempting to navigate through the absolute nightmare of living with mesh for 12 years.”

That is the heartbreaking testimony of Isobel from Prestwick, one of my constituents. She got in touch when there was nowhere else to turn, after years of suffering due to the mesh implant. She has given me permission to tell her story today.

Twelve years ago, Isobel received the implant in the hope that it would improve her quality of life after the birth of her second child. The mesh, which had been around for a number of years before that, was hailed as a revolutionary treatment for women suffering from stress incontinence or a prolapse, issues that arise from having children. Isobel’s surgery was to correct a prolapsed bladder. Fast forward to now, and Isobel has had to have six surgeries to correct the damage and remove the mesh, and a hysterectomy. However, every day, she continues to live with chronic pain in her legs and buttocks, bladder complications, erosion of tissue and, sadly, the original problem of the bladder prolapse. The pain was so great that she had to call time on her 30-year career in education.

It is not just Isobel—today, we have heard countless stories of women who have severe and constant pain in their abdomen, stomach, bladder or limbs. We have heard stories about women in wheelchairs and, sadly, about deaths.

The women going through that living hell have had to fight every step of the way to get help. Through evidence sessions and inquiries, they shared the most intimate details of their medical history, while still being in pain, and having nowhere to turn.

Only 5cm of mesh was ever removed from Isobel, with the mesh centre in Glasgow discharging her, saying that there was nothing more that it could do.

Earlier this year, women were promised surgery in England and the US to correct the wrongs that were caused by the mesh implants. We must do more, and we must act quicker, because women say that they feel like they have been forgotten about. Sometimes, the wait to see a specialist can be up to two years. Women are suffering day to day, and two years is an eternity. We must be prepared to pay for the damage that has been caused.

Day-to-day living is getting harder for Isobel. She has left no stone unturned in her pursuit of a better quality of life. Finally, Isobel turned to me. It is important that I am the last in the chain. I need to find a solution for her. I am acutely aware that the solution is money.

For some women, the Government’s announcement gave them hope, which is a feeling that they thought that they had given up on a long time ago. However, we need more than hope and promises—we need action.

The bill seeks to reimburse women who have paid for the procedure themselves, including the travel costs, whether that be to Bristol or the US. As has been mentioned, the cost of the procedure can vary between £16,000 and £23,000. Many people like Isobel just do not have the money to pay those costs up front. We must remove all barriers to the surgery that seeks to give back some quality of life.

Isobel told me:

“Because of the ongoing complications and chronic pain ... my youngest daughter has never met the real me.”

She describes that as the worst of all the side effects.

We cannot turn back the clock, but we can correct matters going forward. We need to streamline the pathways that will, ultimately, give Isobel her life back. We need a concrete achievable timeline. Her daughter cannot afford to wait another two years to meet the real Isobel.

I am grateful that the Scottish Government, through the bill, will help the women. However, today, I ask that we go further, and that we make referrals and decisions more quickly, that we put in place contracts for the removal of mesh and we put in place funding across the board, not just for those who can afford to pay for the surgery up front.

I welcome the committee’s recommendation to request further detail from the Government on campaigns to publicise the complex mesh national surgical service, on the training for primary care staff on mesh complications and on the person-centred approaches to supporting individuals through treatment, including pre and post-operative support.

I ask the cabinet secretary to comment on cases such as Isobel’s. If my constituent does not wish to have further surgery in Glasgow and wants to choose her own consultant, such as Dr Veronikis, to carry out the procedure, would the Government consider supporting such women, to bring peace of mind and a conclusion to their ordeal?

It is only fitting that I end with Isobel’s words:

“Many ‘older’ mesh survivors who have been through the system have been discriminated against and ignored. Time is running out.”

I welcome stage 1 of the bill as we move to rectify the situation.

I thank the First Minister for the update this afternoon. Given that the general public are still being encouraged to do two lateral flow tests a week, and in light of this afternoon’s announcement by the First Minister encouraging us to test before we go out, when someone tests positive for Covid and self-isolates for 10 days, and therefore has a certain immunity, when should they resume doing the lateral flow tests?

Thank you. I ask Leon Thompson from UKHospitality the same questions.

Good morning and welcome to the 11th meeting of the COVID-19 Recovery Committee in 2021. This morning we will continue our inquiry into baseline health protection measures, with a specific focus on how the measures are working in the hospitality, business and leisure sectors.

I welcome to the meeting Gavin Stevenson, from the Scottish Licensed Trade Association; Leon Thompson, executive director, Scotland, UKHospitality; Barry McCulloch, head of policy, Federation of Small Businesses Scotland; Kirsty Cumming, chief executive of Community Leisure UK; and Professor Irene Petersen, professor of epidemiology and health informatics at University College London. Thank you for giving us your time this morning.

This is the third of four planned evidence sessions on baseline health protection measures. The measures are the main tools that we are using to respond to Covid-19 and include ventilation, face coverings, social distancing and vaccination.

Each member will have approximately 12 minutes to speak to the panel and ask their questions. We are tight for time this morning and have a number of witnesses, so I ask you to please keep your responses as brief as possible. Do not feel that you have to answer every question. I apologise in advance: if time runs on too much, I may have to interrupt members or witnesses in the interests of brevity. I will begin by asking the first question.

As we move into winter and try to keep as many businesses open as possible, the committee has been looking at baseline health protection measures such as ventilation, on which the committee heard from experts on 4 November. I remember, Mr Stevenson, that when you appeared before the committee on 16 September 2021 you told us that, in general, large nightclubs already have good-quality ventilation systems in place. The Scottish Government has announced £25 million for businesses to improve ventilation and install CO₂ monitors to reduce transmission.

How well ventilated are premises in the leisure and hospitality sectors? How many businesses currently have CO₂ monitors? Are businesses considering their use?

I will go to Gavin Stevenson first.

Thank you. I move on to Murdo Fraser.

Thank you very much, Deputy First Minister. I will turn to questions, of which I have two. The first one is very brief. I know that all members have been inundated with emails about a campaign, so I would like to have clarity from the Scottish Government. Is the Scottish Government planning to implement vaccination passports for children?

Before we move on to Alex Rowley, I remind members and witnesses that we are a bit short of time. Please stick to about eight minutes for questions and answers. Thank you.

Thank you. I think that we all appreciate how challenging the situation is for the industry at the moment.

We have a little bit of time, so I will ask one more question. Looking at barriers for businesses at the moment, what are your views of the impact on leisure and hospitality, particularly in town and city centres and also in local communities, of the continuing shift to home working?

Do members have any other questions for our witnesses today?