Chamber and committees

I welcome the Scottish Government’s update to the strategic framework. This is an important moment in our recovery.

The past two years have affected everyone in Scotland, some more than others. We have all had to sacrifice a great deal, and many people have lost loved ones before their time. I join members in expressing my condolences to them.

In March 2020, when Covid-19 hit, the world was not prepared. Close to two years to the day later, we can say that lessons must be learned so that we are never again in that position. I am glad that the Scottish Government is committed to learning the lessons of the pandemic, to bolster Scotland’s response to any future crisis. That is the responsible thing to do. It is not a power grab.

Our vaccination programme has been a tremendous success, thanks to the work of the dedicated staff and volunteers. Because of that, we have a bright and optimistic future ahead of us.

The strategic framework marks the point at which we move away—I hope sustainably—from legal restrictions to reliance on sensible behaviour, adaptations and mitigations. Our return to normality must go hand in hand with a continuing determination to look out for one another.

I hope that members of all parties will welcome the transition of most of the remaining restrictions from legislation to guidance—[Inaudible.] Now is the right time to make those changes. The majority of the population is vaccinated and numbers in intensive care are low.

However, we must remember that case numbers continue to be high, due to the BA.2 variant of omicron. Only last week, the COVID-19 Recovery Committee heard that, during the week before last, more than 4,000 NHS staff members in Scotland were off work with Covid. We must acknowledge the impact of that on our services. As Jackie Baillie said, the pressure on the NHS is immense.

We must also acknowledge that Scotland is not alone in facing pressure on its health services. Countries around the globe face on-going challenges because of Covid-19.

As we transition to the new phase, I welcome the fact that the Scottish Government will continue to consider people who are at the highest clinical risk in a way that provides reassurance and support to people who feel particularly vulnerable and anxious. We all have a part to play in ensuring a safe and sustainable recovery.

At the moment, media attention is, quite rightly, largely focused on the on-going crisis in Ukraine—another development that is, frankly, heartbreaking; it is the last thing that the world needs right now. However, the emergence in December of the omicron variant showed us that we need to remain vigilant. If a new variant emerges, we will get very little warning and the Government might need to act swiftly to curb the spread of the virus. No one wants that, but it is right that the Scottish Government is vigilant and prepared to respond quickly to mitigate harm and potentially avoid the need for more stringent interventions later.

Therefore, although the future appears to be positive and we can start to work towards recovery from the pandemic, I thank the Scottish Government for its honesty in saying that it is unable to rule out negative setbacks that are outwith its control. What politician does not want a crystal ball? The strategic framework provides as much clarity as possible.

As convener of the COVID-19 Recovery Committee, I particularly welcome the fact that the Scottish Government will listen to and learn from third sector organisations, to link up our thinking on how best to tackle situations. The committee has received feedback on that time and time again from the organisations that have given the committee valuable evidence. After all, the Covid-19 pandemic was not the first pandemic and it will not be the last.

I hope that I do not sound all doom and gloom. Let me finish on a positive note. A unique opportunity is ahead of us as we recover. We can decide the approach that we take, and we should not waste the opportunity. Together, we can build a fairer and more equal post-pandemic Scotland, where we can solve the inequalities that Covid exacerbated. The strategic framework will help us get to that position.

Thank you. I agree with you. It is extremely important that people get back the confidence to visit their GP and do not ignore warning signs.

My next question is for Dr Fenton of Public Health Scotland and Dr Perez-Reche. What is your interpretation of the excess deaths data?

Finally, we have Dr Francisco Perez-Reche. I hope that I pronounced that correctly.

What are some of the issues that are encountered when organising the witnessing of a named person nomination? Does any of them predate the pandemic?

Thank you. We turn to questions, and I will begin. Some of the previous witnesses in our inquiry have said that, at this stage, it is still very difficult to draw any conclusions on excess deaths and that we might have to wait a considerable time to do that. However, the consultation response from Chest Heart & Stroke Scotland says that, in the past year, there have been

“1,389 more ... deaths at home from heart disease and stroke and 679 fewer in hospital”.

That could be due to people’s reluctance to visit a general practitioner. The response states:

“Latest data shows 25% of people saying they would avoid contacting their GP at the moment.”

Those statistics are very worrying. Lawrence, would you like to comment further?

That concludes our evidence session. I thank Dr Chopra and Dr Smyth for their evidence and time. If witnesses would like to provide any further evidence to the committee, they can do so in writing. The clerks are happy to liaise with them on how to do that.

The committee’s next meeting will be 17 March, when we will take evidence from the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Care on the inquiry into excess deaths in Scotland since the start of the pandemic. We will also take evidence from the Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Covid Recovery on the latest ministerial statement on Covid-19 and subordinate legislation.

Good morning and welcome to the eighth meeting in 2022 of the COVID-19 Recovery Committee. This morning, we will continue our inquiry into excess deaths in Scotland since the start of the pandemic.

I welcome Rob Gowans, policy and public affairs manager at the Health and Social Care Alliance Scotland; Lawrence Cowan, director of communications at Chest Heart & Stroke Scotland; Peter Hastie, policy and public affairs manager at Macmillan Cancer Support; Dr Lynda Fenton, consultant in public health medicine at Public Health Scotland; and Dr Francisco Perez-Reche from the institute for complex systems and mathematical biology in the school of natural and computing sciences at the University of Aberdeen. Thank you for giving us your time and for your written submissions.

This is the second of two sessions that we are holding to take evidence from stakeholders as part of our inquiry before we hear from the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Care on 17 March.

Each member will have approximately nine to 10 minutes to speak to the panel and ask their questions. If you would like to respond on a particular issue that is being discussed, please type the letter R in the chat box and we will do our best to bring you in. I am keen to ensure that everyone gets an opportunity to speak. I apologise in advance that, if time runs on too much, I may have to interrupt members or witnesses in the interest of brevity.

All our witnesses are appearing remotely. I ask you to briefly introduce yourselves, starting with Rob Gowans.

Thank you, Mr Fairlie.

I thank the witnesses for their evidence and for giving us their time this morning. If you would like to raise any further evidence with the committee, you can do so in writing. The clerks will be happy to liaise with you on how to do that.

I suspend the meeting to allow for a changeover of witnesses.

Under agenda item 2, the committee will continue to take evidence at stage 1 of the Coronavirus (Recovery and Reform) (Scotland) Bill. The focus of this evidence session will be on the named person nomination provision contained in part 3 of the bill.

I welcome to the committee Dr Arun Chopra, the medical director of the Mental Welfare Commission for Scotland, and Dr Roger Smyth, chair of the legislative oversight forum of the Royal College of Psychiatrists in Scotland. I thank them for giving us their time and for their written submissions.

I will give members the opportunity to ask the witnesses questions. If one of the witnesses would like to respond to an issue that is being discussed, they should type R in the chat box and we will try to bring them in.

As our witnesses join us remotely, I ask them to introduce themselves.

What are the potential benefits and risks associated with the proposal to remove the requirement for a nominee as a named person to have their signature witnessed by a prescribed person?