Chamber and committees

Good morning, panel. It is great to see you this morning. Do you agree with the provisions in part 6 of the bill on the ability to suspend people’s benefit payments if they repeatedly fail to provide the information required to Social Security Scotland?

Will the minister set out what role Scotland’s universities have in supporting the outdoor learning sector?

Finally, in what way would the bill improve the client experience? Are there any provisions that would make the client experience worse, and is there anything that you think is missing?

To what extent does the bill align with the social security principles?

Good morning to everyone in the room and online. We appreciate your time this morning. Does anyone have any comments on specific measures in the bill that we have not already discussed? I invite those in the room to answer first.

Thank you. I see that no one else wants to respond.

To ask the Scottish Government what it is doing to promote the uptake of the Scottish child payment. (S6O-03198)

Will the cabinet secretary comment on the impact that the payment is having on keeping children in Scotland out of poverty? Does she share my concerns about the Westminster Government’s two-child policy undermining our efforts? Will she be clear that the two-child policy and its abhorrent rape clause will never be considered for the Scottish child payment?

As a member of the Social Justice and Social Security Committee, I thank the committee clerks for their assistance with the production of our report. We received helpful evidence from a range of expert witnesses and people with lived experience, who provided a considerable amount of information that was extremely helpful in reaching our conclusions.

Tackling child poverty, especially without the full powers to do so, is complex but essential. That is why it is a national mission for the Scottish Government and one that can be achieved only if we tackle all the drivers of poverty. Every sector and Government must be up for that mission. Currently, too many families are locked in to in-work poverty and are unable to progress in the labour market, while others are unable to access the labour market at all due to structural barriers. The committee agrees that we need to ensure that there is good-quality flexible work as a route out of poverty, while targeting support for those who are unable to work.

The Scottish Government’s “Best Start, Bright Futures: Tackling Child Poverty Delivery Plan 2022-2026” aims to support up to 12,000 parents to access and sustain employment and up to 3,000 in-work parents to increase their earnings. To do that, the Scottish Government proposes investments in employability support, improvements in connectivity and childcare, the promotion of fair work and investment into local and regional economies. To fully achieve that, the committee agrees that the Government must supercharge its efforts and take decisive action now.

The Scottish Government aims to make employability services contribute to reducing poverty and inequality and transform the economy. Alongside COSLA, it is jointly exploring opportunities to scale up employability support for parents. Of course, employability services need resources to deliver interventions throughout people’s journeys, so we need to know how those services will be scaled up, particularly after the funding for the support that is offered by fair start Scotland ends in April.

There are many recommendations in the committee’s report and I cannot cover them all in the time that I have available, so I will highlight a further three issues. Not being able to access childcare is a common barrier to employment, which mostly affects women. There is also a particular issue with accessing childcare for children who have additional support needs. Children’s Hospices Across Scotland—CHAS—gave the following example to the committee:

“Just the other day, I was talking to a parent who had in place a very significant package of support but was simply unable to recruit the staff that she needed to support the child, so she is giving up work in order to be the sole carer for her child.”—[Official Report, Social Justice and Social Security Committee, 8 June 2023; c 15.]

That is why, as a committee, we want to see a detailed assessment of the availability of the current childcare workforce across the sector, including those with skills for children who have additional support needs.

The social security system acting as a barrier to getting into or staying in employment is another significant issue. The universal credit conditionality regime does nothing to support people into work and often causes misery and hardship instead. Marion Davis of One Parent Families Scotland, when illustrating the significant impact on lone parents, told us:

“we end up having to take them to food banks because they have had their benefits cut. That has a huge impact on employability and adds to the crisis that families face, which prevents them from moving on and achieving what they want to achieve.”

Philip Whyte of the Institute for Public Policy Research Scotland, in evidence to us regarding conditionality, said:

“we have collected a lot of UK-wide evidence ... that suggests that the regime is still incredibly punitive rather than supportive. That ratchets up underemployment, because people are quite often directed to, and take, low-quality jobs.”—[Official Report, Social Justice and Social Security Committee, 15 June 2023; c 37.]

It is clear that that approach does not set work on a strong track to help to reduce poverty. Instead, work must pay, and it must be flexible. Providing jobs that pay a fair wage and are family friendly, with flexibility in order to meet parents’ needs, is central to tackling child poverty through employment.

In that area, we are also hindered by our lack of control over employment law. Encouragement can only secure so much. That is why, on behalf of the STUC, Andrea Bradley told us:

“From an STUC point of view, we want to see Scotland in control of the levers that will have the greatest impact on the pay, conditions and working lives of people in Scotland. For that reason, we want to see the devolution of employment law to Scotland.”—[Official Report, Social Justice and Social Security Committee, 22 June 2023; c 32.]

Until we secure the necessary employment powers, I welcome the approach that has been taken by the fair work first policy. We must use that approach to maximise and secure what working people deserve. To that end, I welcome the fact that we are looking at the procurement and tendering process as a way to secure decent terms and conditions.

The aim of tackling child poverty through parental employment is so important to get right. By helping parents to access secure, stable and flexible employment, we can offer a sustainable route out of poverty for many families. As we know, every child should live happy and healthy lives and be able to reach their full potential. Let us push forward on that and prioritise the policies that really tackle child poverty.

Are any other potential negatives that we should be aware of?