Local Government and Communities Committee, 04 Feb 2009

Meeting date: Wednesday, February 4, 2009

Official Report 221KB pdf

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Subordinate Legislation

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Non-Domestic Rating (Petrol Filling Stations, Public Houses and Hotels) (Scotland) Order 2009 (Draft)

The cabinet secretary stays with us for item 2, which is subordinate legislation. He is joined by Scottish Government officials: David Henderson, head of the local government finance division; James Gilmour, a senior policy officer in the local government division; and Tony Rednall, a policy officer in the criminal law and licensing division. I welcome you all, and I invite the cabinet secretary to make introductory remarks.

Thank you. The draft order is necessitated by the Licensing (Scotland) Act 2005 and will take account of changes to the definition of "licensed premises" and bring secondary legislation into line with the 2005 act. The 2005 act, which will come into force on 1 September, will completely replace the Licensing (Scotland) Act 1976 and will introduce a new and very different regime. From 1 September, people who want to sell alcohol will need a premises licence, which will name a premises manager who holds a personal licence. The 1976 act underpins the existing secondary legislation—the Non-Domestic Rating (Petrol Filling Stations, Public Houses and Hotels) (Scotland) Order 2003 (SSI 2003/188)—so a new order is required.

The draft order will ensure that eligible petrol stations, public houses and hotels in Scotland's rural settlements can continue to benefit from rates relief. Scotland's rural rates-relief scheme was introduced in April 2003 in recognition of concerns about the decline of services in small rural communities. There is continuing concern about the provision of services in such areas. The Government seeks to support, sustain and enhance our rural communities through a range of measures, including the rural rates-relief scheme. We acknowledge the contribution that the provision of services by public houses, petrol stations and hotels can make to rural communities. Such premises can be an important focus for communities and, in some cases, provide community facilities such as meeting rooms and other services that would not otherwise be provided.

I hope that my remarks were helpful to the committee and I am happy to answer questions.

Thank you. I invite members to question the cabinet secretary and his officials.

Cabinet secretary, the draft order contains definitions of "petrol filling station", "public house or hotel" and "ratepayer". Does the principal act define "settlement"? I note that the rates relief will apply to a public house or hotel only if

"there is no other public house or hotel in the settlement concerned."

Is there a statutory definition of "settlement"?

Yes, there is. The areas in which the rural rates-relief scheme applies are defined elsewhere in regulations. The definition is to do with the number of people who live in areas that have certain postcodes. If a pub or hotel is the only one in such an area, it will qualify for relief. Column 2 of the schedule to the Non-Domestic Rating (Rural Areas and Rateable Value Limits) (Scotland) Order 1997 (SI 1997/2827) lists the localities.

Right, so areas are deemed to be settlements by reference to their postcodes and there is no generalised definition of the concept of a settlement.

I think that the 1997 order to which Mr Henderson referred lists localities that are excluded from being defined as settlements. The scheme applies to

"settlements of less than 3,000 people"

in designated areas—in essence, there is a threshold. The order does not list settlements that have a population of less than 3,000; it excludes from the equation areas that have a population above that level—that is how the definition of "settlement" is arrived at.

However a settlement is defined—whether it is defined as falling below one line or in another way—a settlement or locality must still be defined. I do not ask such questions to trip you up on the fine print. There are several measures—including one that I hope that we will take through the Parliament in the next year, following the budget—that depend on defining boundaries of settlements and town centres, for example. I am interested in whether we have definitions for that purpose. Do we have a general definition that applies to a settlement, the centre of a town or the centre of a village, or must we go through every postcode and say which qualifies and which does not in order to operate such arrangements in legislation?

I will explain what I said further. The order that Mr Henderson talked about defines rural areas for the purposes of the scheme on the basis of the application of the General Register Office for Scotland's postcode classification of what is urban and rural. That creates what could be described as a threshold. A settlement with a population of 3,000 or more would be defined through that classification as an urban settlement. Beneath that, the methodology from the General Register Office is applied to what constitutes rural settlements. Ultimately, the process that Mr McLetchie talked about will be followed. People will say, "That's this settlement," and "That's that settlement"—I hope that that explanation is clear to the committee.

I will give examples from my constituency. Blairgowrie, which has a population of about 8,000 or 9,000, would be defined as an urban settlement, whereas the village of Woodside—where I reside—which has 150 houses and is 4 miles from the nearest town, would be defined as a rural settlement. However, we would be hard pressed to define a hamlet such as Campmuir, which is a mile or so away from the village in which I live, as an individual settlement to satisfy the order. That was a helpful geographical illustration of Perthshire.

I look forward to visiting those parts.

You are very welcome.

Members have no more questions, so we move to agenda item 3, which is the debate on the motion.

Motion moved,

That the Local Government and Communities Committee recommends that the draft Non-Domestic Rating (Petrol Filling Stations, Public Houses and Hotels) (Scotland) Order 2009 be approved.—[John Swinney.]

Motion agreed to.

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Non-Domestic Rate (Scotland) Order 2009 (SSI 2009/3)

Item 4 is a negative instrument that relates to the affirmative order that we have just considered. As members have no points for clarification, do we agree to make no recommendations on the order?

Members indicated agreement.

We move to item—[Interruption.] I forgot to thank the cabinet secretary for his attendance and help.

I am dispatched.

I thought that you had slipped out of the door and rushed off.