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Chamber and committees

European and External Relations Committee, 02 Dec 2003

Meeting date: Tuesday, December 2, 2003


Contents


Convener's Report

The Convener:

The first item of my report returns to the issue raised by the previous European and External Relations Committee about the Government's position on tripartite contracts between itself, the UK Government and the European Union. Europe proposed that that route be taken, whereby all three levels of government would come together, in order to reduce bureaucracy and lead to better decision making and implementation of EU legislation.

An answer to my parliamentary question revealed that the Scottish Executive has undertaken no such agreement, despite the fact that feedback to the committee indicated that the Executive was keen to promote them. That is why the matter is on the agenda. Are there any comments?

Irene Oldfather:

I am generally in favour of tripartite contracts. They are a good thing and the previous committee supported the idea.

I have not seen your parliamentary question or the answer, and it would have been helpful if those had been reproduced for the committee. All I have is a synopsis that says that the Executive answer was simply no. I am aware that such projects are still at the pilot stage. Neil MacCormick's opinion was still in draft in September, so it might be that the Executive has not made a formal application because the issue is still under discussion. We need a little bit more information and I am happy for us to seek clarification. However, not having seen the parliamentary question, I do not know if the no means that the Executive has not yet applied, or it is no longer interested. I would be very surprised if the answer was that the Executive is no longer interested, given that the issue formed part of the UK submission to the convention to which the National Assembly for Wales and the Scottish Executive signed up. We need clarification.

I note that the message seems to be contradictory, but I have not seen the question and am therefore not sure that that is the case.

The Convener:

That is a fair comment. In future, when we refer to parliamentary questions, a copy should be attached to the papers. I will ask the clerks to do that. The question was just whether there are any such tripartite contracts and the Executive gave a one word answer.

Irene Oldfather:

That could be technically correct, but it does not mean that the Executive is not interested in undertaking the agreement. It might mean that it is all still at draft stage. That would not surprise me in the least because the European Parliament report was in draft in September and it urges the Commission to develop pilot studies. It might be that we are waiting for the Commission to make proposals. I would not want to read too much into the Executive's answer. We need clarification.

Is the committee happy to seek that clarification? The issue has been raised before and such contracts would make a change to how things were done if the idea were taken up.

Members indicated agreement.

The Convener:

Item 2 relates to an issue that John Home Robertson raised, which is the movement of heavy goods vehicles through the EU and the fact that some countries, notably Austria, charge those vehicles for passing through the country because they do not pay road tax in that country. We have received a letter from Gwyneth Dunwoody MP, chair of the House of Commons Transport Committee, inviting the committee to make a submission to her committee's inquiry into EU transport policy.

Mr Home Robertson:

I dropped a note to the clerk a month or two ago asking that the issue be raised. Hauliers in my constituency have pointed out to me that there are a significant number of HGVs from mainland Europe on our roads, using fuel on which they have paid much less tax and competing with our hauliers. When an HGV crosses a border on mainland Europe, particularly into Austria, the driver has to buy a Eurovignette to pay up the difference. British truck drivers in mainland Europe therefore have to pay.

I do not understand why the UK Government does not impose the same requirements on trucks coming from mainland Europe. It is worth making that point to the House of Commons Transport Committee. If the clerk could draft something on that, perhaps it could be considered further.

On behalf of the committee, can I ask John Home Robertson to work with the clerks to draft a submission?

Can you clarify that that is the inquiry that will also examine issues that relate to public service obligation orders?

Are you seeking clarification of the title of the inquiry by the House of Commons committee?

Yes.

As far as I am aware the inquiry is only into EU transport policy, but I will double-check.

The title of the inquiry is "Transport in the European Union"; it could well cover the matter to which you refer.

I will perhaps have a chat in private with the clerks to see whether there is anything that we can meaningfully do on public service obligation orders on air routes.

Are you reflecting your experience earlier this afternoon?

Not at all. That was to do with the fog in Edinburgh.

The Convener:

We are happy to take that point on board.

If the committee is happy with that, our thanks go to John Home Robertson for agreeing to liaise with the clerks on drafting a submission.

The next item in the convener's report is the letter that has been received from the Minister for Finance and Public Services on the subject of the euro preparations committee, on which the Scottish Executive is represented. We asked for an update and we have received the letter that is in the committee papers. It gives web links to the minutes of the meetings. There is not a great deal of information in the reply from the minister, but it is open to members to click on the web to read the minutes. I suggest that we ask the minister to make that information available to the Scottish Parliament information centre, so that the minutes are available to all MSPs.

Irene Oldfather:

Perhaps the clerks to the committee would want to click on the link and make the information available to committee members and to SPICe. We seem to be batting this backwards and forwards. We could be very pedantic about the matter and write back to the Executive and say, "You draw it down from the internet, or we will draw it down from the internet." If the information is publicly available, let us agree that somebody downloads it and circulates it. The committee has an interest in the matter, so I do not see why we should not do that.

The Convener:

There is certainly an issue in that if we ask for information from the Executive it should give us the information, as opposed to our having to ask the clerks to download it, but I am sure that we can get it one way or another. We can ask the clerks to liaise with the Scottish Executive to reach a mutual agreement.

The next item is a copy of the transcript, provided by the official report, of the videoconference that we had with the Finnish Parliament's Grand Committee, which was attended by a number of members. That is simply for information. We record our thanks to the official report for going to the trouble of producing the transcript and to the information technology department and everybody else who was involved in setting up the videoconference.

The next item is the letter from the UK Department for Constitutional Affairs on the number of MEPs. The issue has been debated in the chamber and, incidentally, it will be debated in the chamber again on Thursday in SNP time.

Dennis Canavan:

I am happy to go along with your recommendation that we thank Christopher Leslie, parliamentary under-secretary of state in the UK Department of Constitutional Affairs, for the courtesy of a quick response, but I would not like him to get the idea that we are in any way satisfied with that response. If we are writing to thank him, we should also, for the record, express our dissatisfaction.

The Convener:

That is a sensible proposal. As there are no objections, we will follow that suggestion.

The next item in the convener's report is new evidence to our two inquiries. That evidence is now publicly available on the website, and we will consider it at future meetings.

The final item in the convener's report is an analysis of the European Commission's work programme for 2004. We requested the information because I know that certain members of the committee were interested in receiving the briefing.

Irene Oldfather:

Convener, I had said that I would represent the committee on your behalf at the meeting of EMILE—the European members information liaison exchange network—but an urgent constituency matter has come up. I understand that John Home Robertson and Phil Gallie are both attending the EMILE meeting. John Home Robertson has indicated that he would be happy—

I do not know about happy.

He has said that he would be willing to say a few words on behalf of the committee. If Phil Gallie will be there and is also willing to say a few words, that would assist me in meeting an urgent constituency engagement.

The buck stops here.

I thank Phil Gallie and John Home Robertson for being genuinely delighted to do that. I am sure that the meeting will be productive.

Phil Gallie:

I know that this will sound repetitive, but as far as the Commission's work programme is concerned I am very aware of its failure to get its accounts audited. I would have thought that auditing those accounts would have been a top priority that the European Commission would have mentioned in its work programme for the next year and over coming years.

I do not know how other members feel about the matter, but I am quite sure that everyone is concerned about it.

I think that Phil Gallie has made a fair point that is worth pursuing.

We can do that.

Irene Oldfather:

It is worth while noting that the emphasis in the work programme over the next year is on enlargement. The Commission has clearly indicated that this year's legislative programme is lighter than normal because of the work that needs to be done to bring in the accession countries. Various financial bodies scrupulously audit all European institutions. For example, the Committee of the Regions has just been through an audit by the European Anti-fraud Office—or OLAF—which, along with the European Court of Justice, is responsible for auditing. Although I sometimes come across scaremongering stories in the press about gravy trains and money that goes missing, I have found in the past that the European Court of Auditors' reports on these matters are very detailed and specific. Indeed, the recent Committee of the Regions audit was very thorough and resulted in a member being paid back money rather than in members having to pay money back. I do not think that that story received any media attention.

Phil Gallie:

Page 13 of the convener's report suggests that one of the Commission's major projects is—quite rightly—to sustain growth. I would ask whether the Commission is able to attain any growth at present, given Europe's woeful performance. It is right to attempt to create growth, but I think that, given current performance, this talk of "sustainable growth" is—to repeat a phrase that was used earlier—a bit tongue-in-cheek.

The Convener:

Given that the minister with responsibility for Europe and external relations is also responsible for finance, you can raise those points with him directly the next time that he appears before us.

On Saturday, a number of MSPs and I attended the Scottish Youth Parliament in Aberdeen. I notice that the analysis of the Commission's work programme in the convener's report highlights a number of youth issues. Perhaps we can ask the clerks to send a copy of this paper and a cover note to the Scottish Youth Parliament to make it aware of issues in Europe that it might find interesting.

It is also worth mentioning that the Scottish Youth Parliament has what I think is called the European and external relations committee—I am not 100 per cent sure about that—and when I spoke to its members on Saturday I suggested that we might be able to build links with it.

Irene Oldfather:

I agree with those comments. Last year, I had the enjoyable experience of hosting the Scottish Youth Parliament in my constituency. I have found young people to be almost the most euro-enthusiastic people I have come across and they certainly appreciated the number of local MSPs who came along to support their conference at James Watt College in Kilwinning. As a result, I am very happy to continue those links.

I thank Scotland Europa for its analysis of the work programme, into which it put a lot of effort.

In light of Irene Oldfather's comment about enthusiastic MSPs, I want to put on record that I was one of them.

Yes. Indeed, I was thinking along the same lines when Irene was speaking. I am sure that the young people she mentions will maintain their enthusiasm into adulthood.