I am grateful for the opportunity to open the discussion on this group of amendments. I start by stressing the areas on which I think that we all agree.
We agree on the importance of independent advocacy and advice, we agree that it is vital that people have a right to receive information about how to access the support that they need when interacting with the new social security agency and we agree that there should be a statutory duty on ministers to ensure that people know about the independent advocacy and advice services that are available. All that said, I take this opportunity to ask Jeremy Balfour not to move his amendments 58, 59 and 75 because—as other members and I know—there remain disagreements among stakeholders about the appropriate definition of the group of people who should receive that support.
I well understand the difficulty, and I am sure that Mr Balfour and colleagues do, too. It is not easy, but I want us to try to reach agreement. I ask Mr Balfour not to proceed on the basis of disagreement, but to work with us to see whether we can reach an agreement with stakeholders and representative organisations in advance of stage 3. I think that an agreement can be reached, but I want us to use our time before stage 3 to get this right and ensure that we provide support for those who need it.
As things stand, amendment 9 sets out the Scottish Government’s starting point—our baseline, if you will—that we are prepared to move on, if we can reach an agreement in advance of stage 3 on how far we need to move. Amendment 9 provides a specific right to advocacy and places the Scottish Government under a direct duty to ensure that sufficient advocacy services are available. We have used the definition of “mental disorder” set out in the Mental Health (Care and Treatment) (Scotland) Act 2003 as our starting point—I stress that this is only a starting point—to define the group who will have the statutory right to advocacy.
I consider that individuals covered by the definition in the 2003 act, which includes those with learning difficulties, mental illness or a personality disorder, are those who would most benefit from an advocate to assist them in discussions with the social security agency. However, I realise that there might be others who do not fall into that category but who require such advocacy and, as I have said, I am open to further discussion with regard to developing the definition in advance of stage 3.
I believe that our proposals are further strengthened by amendment 39, which establishes a right for an individual to have “a supporter” if they need or want one. A supporter could be a friend, a family member or someone from any of the excellent organisations that provide independent advocacy and advice services across Scotland. As I have heard—indeed, Pauline McNeill raised this during the stage 1 debate—the right to a supporter is not consistently honoured in health assessments under the current DWP system. That runs contrary to our rights-based approach. If we truly want our system to have fairness, dignity and respect at its heart, we should give people the right to have a person to support them when they need it.
Amendments 58, 59 and 75, in the name of Mr Balfour, also address the issue of advice and advocacy. Amendment 58 would put in the bill a right for independent information and advice to be provided to anyone applying for—or thinking about applying for—Scottish social security assistance. Although I agree with the intent in principle—indeed, it is similar to the aims of my amendment 8—Mr Balfour’s amendment provides a list of information and advice topics that should be provided, and I do not think that we should restrict what information and advice should be provided. I believe that providers of independent advice, who are, by definition, independent from the system, should be allowed to advise on any aspect of social security, as well as operate in a manner that best serves their clients. Moreover, much of what is listed in amendment 58, such as the assistance that an individual is entitled to or the content of the social security charter, is covered by other aspects of the bill. As a result, I ask Mr Balfour not to move amendment 58 and urge the committee to support amendment 8 in my name.
Amendment 59, in the name of Mr Balfour, widens the entitlement of independent advocacy services to everyone who has applied for Scottish social security assistance. As I have said, we know that our stakeholders are divided on this matter and, before we get to stage 3, I want to reach agreement on a definition of the group that requires this support. I therefore urge Mr Balfour to work with us, our stakeholders and indeed the committee to ensure that we secure that agreement in advance of stage 3. As for amendment 75, which is also in the name of Mr Balfour, it is merely technical and, as such, would not be required if he were to choose not to move amendments 58 and 59.
I am pleased to support amendment 112 in the name of Ms Maguire on inclusive communication, as it goes to the heart of our ambitions to take a rights-based approach and to place the needs of individuals at the centre of this new public service. Indeed, I know that stakeholders have pressed for such an amendment.
Of course, amendment 112 means that amendment 139, in the name of Mark Griffin, is not required, because their aims are essentially the same. Moreover, in my view, amendment 139 has difficulties, because it is overly prescriptive with regard to the kinds of information that it lists, such as claim forms and notices of determination. If amendment 112 is agreed to, those basic and fundamental documents will be provided to people in an accessible format as a matter of course. In addition, it is important to remember that two of the founding ideals of our system are co-production and a rights-based approach. The people who will use the system are, through experience panels and other means, helping us design correspondence and forms and are therefore helping us to make sure that they and other aspects of the system are accessible.
I have already asked Mr Balfour not to move amendments 58, 59 and 75 but, if he chooses to go ahead with them, I urge the committee to support neither them nor amendment 139 from Mr Griffin. Instead, I ask members to support amendments 8, 9 and 39 in my name and amendment 112 in the name of Ms Maguire. I believe that these amendments, alongside previous amendments, will provide a much stronger legislative framework for advocacy, advice and support for those who will use the social security system. We have the opportunity not only to move forward on this matter today but to continue discussions in advance of stage 3 in order to reach further agreement on the question of independent advocacy.
I move amendment 8.
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